Failure.

[VirginiaSouthern]

Your line about improving infrastructure touches of something I've discussed with a few people before. IMO, CSX would profit greatly in the long run from doubletracking its north-south mainline. Yes the intitial costs would be big and it would cause an increase in maintenance costs, but the capacity that those lines could handle would bring greater profits.

I always carry my scanner with me whenever I go to pick up my fiance from the train station in Florence, SC. Trains are always backed up along the line both north and south of the yard and that is without any technical difficulties, crew shift expirations, etc. As a fringe benefit (not that I think this is a reason for doubletracking), Amtrak would be able to operate a little more efficiently on the NY to FL trains.

I know that's a bit off topic from the original part of the thread, but since the discussion has strayed that way I just thought I'd add my two cents into it.

[HaggisKennedy]

The guidelines do make it difficult, but the one thing the STB can't control is the external market/economic factors which could trump them. At some point in time, the overall business case will be made so that merging will be the preferred method vs Federal Bailout/interference with a private industry concern. The farther time goes along, and the world economy changes, the more likely this could happen.

Again, it's that long-term outlook, 5-10yrs down the road, and positioning yourself to respond to changes.

Kennedy

[mattliverpool]

I agree in your posting. It is hard to determine five to ten years down the road. I think maybe the days of large mergers have come to an end? I could be wrong? I think the Northeastern market will not see much change in the coming years.

Matt

[HaggisKennedy]

Going back to the original question again, and a followup comment about provoking some thought on the matter, I dug out my copy of the book 'Main Lines', by Richard Saunders. It's Book II covering the 1970-2002 period and the rebirth of NA RRs.

I'm not a RR historian so I don't really know how accurate the book is, but for what the original question was about, the author goes back about 5 years to talk about the state of the merger world relating to RRs. He says that in the west, the UP-RI fiasco was still ongoing, which pretty much stopped any further mergers out there. In the east, the Penn Central thing was still ongoing. The BN merger in '70 still hadn't fully shaken out yet. So, there was somewhat of a merger lull.

The author relates a story stating that somebody from Forbes Magazine visited the Chessie HQ in '76 or so. On the wall, there was a huge map which laid out the entire Chessie system. Plastic overlays showed the system of every other RR in existence. Once he heard rumors of a merger, he could instantly see what it meant for Chessie, and he could move quickly. He thought that every other RR out there would have a setup like this in their HQ.

In '77, the BN and Frisco announce their merger. Soon after this, SP started to buy SCL stock, quietly. In mid-'78, the media articles about this apparently spooked the SCL board, and they pulled out. SCL asked the ICC to stop SP from buying any more stock, while putting their weight behind the Chessie, who by this time was already buying SCL stock. In essence, Chessie was the "White Knight" here, since SCL didn't want to go with SP, who was still trying to buy them out. Of course, history says that CSX came to be in late '78, and the SP decided to throw in the towel in early '79. The merger was an end-to-end one, and made CSX a huge power in the coal trade, which was important since oil was being threatened (Iran Hostages and all).

I'm not going to get into the implications of the Staggers Act here, I think De-reg and long-haul rates has a big impact on these kinds of mergers, because they maximize income during a period where rates were regulated.

Kennedy

[mattliverpool]

I think intermodal carriers such as BNSF and CSX will be hurt if these ports are purchased by major foreign powers. I believe, the cost to ship and transport from these ports will cause NA RR's to consider different routes or government help. Maybe NA intermodal freight will be redirected to other areas of the country. Making certain railroads stronger and others failing.

Matt

[VirginiaSouthern]

I don't know if the ports being purchased by foreign companies will really have an impact on intermodal carriers. Many port facilities in the US are already owned by companies based outside the US.

[fulltritty]

IMO, CSX would profit greatly in the long run from doubletracking its north-south mainline. Yes the intitial costs would be big and it would cause an increase in maintenance costs, but the capacity that those lines could handle would bring greater profits.

That has been something I have been saying for years as well since railfanning around here and seeing the backups; especially during the week with VRE and MARC commuter trains added to the lines. Of course, it may also get a lot more of this trucks off the I-95 corridor and may enable more commuter serive to get more cars off and then traffic would be a lot better too.

Not to mention the boost in trains to railfan.

[mattliverpool]

I agree with the idea of double tracking the north, south main line. I railfan here in Syracuse, NY. Next to the Chicago double main. The traffic I see in a two hour period is very, very heavy. Amtrak shares this line also. I witness atleast up fourteen trains in that period. The chicago double main, handles 50to sixty trains daily.
I agree with the expense of maintaining the line. CSX has a poor history of track repair. This is evident along the Chicago double main, however; there has not been many large derailments in my area for awhile.
A double main from west to east and north to south would greatly excel CSX profits, not only in intermodal or regular freight, but in competition with other carriers such as NS and the large carriers out west.

Matt

[VirginiaSouthern]

Originally Posted by mattliverpool

CSX has a poor history of track repair. This is evident along the Chicago double main, however; there has not been many large derailments in my area for awhile.

Maybe where you live they have a history of poor track repair, but down in the southeast it doesn't seem to be an issue.

[fulltritty]

At times CSX has had some very poor trackage on the Old Main Line especially around here. I remember going to St. Denis once and watching a coal train on the Old Main Line cause the track to jump up and down in multiple spots along the line. All I could think about was the fact that the MARC Station parking lot was about 4 feet away from that line and my car wouldn't be there anymore if that track gave way. The Old Main Line has a nice problem with broken ties and mud underneath them.